[This transcript has been automatically generated by a digital software and will therefore  contain errors and typos. Please kindly take note of this and only rely on the digital transcript for reference.]

00:00

Hey guys, welcome back to the TED to business show the best place for actionable advice for entrepreneurs. This is Ted, your friend and host speaking. Now on today’s episode, we have john Bostock, who is the co founder of trumans, a company designed to reduce waste and clutter in the consumer cleaning products industry. By asking you and addressing the question of why a consumer cleaning products being shipped with 98% water, humans was able to disrupt an industry that was bulk of supply chain inefficiencies, provide a product that resonated with environmentally conscious consumers and achieve a landmark exit sale in just three years. As the author of the book the elephant’s dilemma, john also shares about his journey breaking free from the safety net of a corporate career and pursuing innovation and entrepreneurship. So guys, if you ever received any value from the show, they don’t deserve to get your support. The best way you can do this is to subscribe to the show, leave a review on Apple podcasts, and to share the show with somebody who will find it useful as well. And now let’s dive right in. Hey, john, thank you so much for joining us today. Such a pleasure to have you here. It’s awesome to be here with you. JOHN, let’s start with a very simple icebreaker Could you share with us so we could all get to know you a bit better? Who is john Bostock, when he is not working? I consider myself to be a pretty average person. I’m a dad, I’ve got two kids, two crazy dogs. I live in New Orleans, Louisiana in the United States, and, you know, really try to live just a great life and raising my kids and giving them every opportunity that I wish I had growing up. So john, what are some of the options they have provided them so far, you know, I think it’s diversity of experience. And I look at my 10 year old, who’s a little bit older than my five year old, and he takes drum lessons and soccer lessons. And all of these things that I didn’t have access to, you know, music wasn’t available to me growing up sports were, but it’s the diversity that I’m really helping my kids connect the dots with, and even travel, we’re spending a lot of time. Obviously, it’s negatively impacted by COVID. But we’re spending a lot of time with the kids to help them see the world and see the diversity that exists within it. Awesome, john. Now let’s talk about the book that you wrote, the elephants don’t themer? What is it about? And what do you hope to achieve it? You know, I mentioned growing up obviously had an impact on me the way that I grew up the people around me, what I observed growing up is my ancestors took really big leaps. In fact, my grandparents came to this country with nothing and took on huge risk in doing so fast forward to me in the middle of my career, I really found myself tethered to this false reality. And what I was tethered to was this idea that this very large company I worked for at the time, was kind of a safety layer. Even though I had all these ideas that I wanted to go out and do something great, make an impact on the world, move my career forward in more innovative ways, I really felt stuck. And it took me 11 years at this very large company develop enough confidence to leave, do something really innovative. And then from there, I looked back and said, You know, I wish that I had done it sooner. And I wish that I could inspire other people to just think more broadly. And look, I’ve had a great career that 11 year career was at the General Electric Company, which is one of the top companies in the world, and certainly had amazing experiences during my time at the company. But as I look back, I wanted to inspire people to just push innovation forward in new ways to think about the world more as a global community, less insulated, less inclusive, and really push people to break free and reimagine their future at work. JOHN, now this wind the clock back a little bit you shared about your 11 years in general electric and I know you spent another few years with big gas fans. So tell us a little bit more about your time in this companies. And what actually led you to finally take that leap to start Truman’s? When did you realize that you had to break your own terrors and what gave you that strength. It was failed attempts. Even before I started GE I wanted to be an entrepreneur, I looked back at my ancestors and thought they took leaps. And I could do it too. I was too young and too inexperienced. And that inexperienced lead to failure. The failure led to going back to business school. And I was lucky in that I went to business school, I was very engaged. I learned a lot and I met someone very influential at GE, I went into the company and had the great opportunity to cycle through different businesses. So at the time, GE would crew recruit people from Business School, and place them in businesses and short term assignments to really understand the business and make an impact in a short period of time. So right away, I looked at GE as this really innovative and dynamic company that was willing to take risk with new people that thought in a different way that didn’t have legacy backgrounds and come into a situation and try to solve it. So I really enjoyed

05:00

That atmosphere and I cycled through GE plastics, which was once part of the business, GE water, GE appliances. And ultimately, I ended up at GE corporate and really that 11 year block was constant learning and constant growth. As I look back at my first jobs in the very beginning, they were tough. And I remember when I was very young, I was leading a product line and global product line, very dynamic, multi channel distribution, very complex, but I learned a lot. Fast forward to later in my GE career, we’re investing in startups, looking at ways to really innovate within the company to disrupt ourselves. And it taught me that ultimately, if you’re going to move business forward, you need to be fast, you need to be agile, you need to look at Lean principles, and say how could we wipe or this category, not rely on all the things that hold us back and not be held back by legacy systems and legacy go to market strategies, but really take totally innovative approach that that really changed my perspective. And as I was looking at what I was going to do next, you bring up big ass fans, which is a crazy named company, but had a really innovative business model. So I had the confidence to finally leave GE and to go into big ass fans, which is very dynamic. It sells large industrial fans, also sells commercial fans and residential fans. But what’s unique about the company is it sells direct. And my experience at at GE was really through traditional distribution was traditional product management, through distribution, and then on to the US consumer. And here was a very fast growing dynamic company with a quirky name that had a really, really innovative business model. And so I took the leap, to leave GE and join big ass fans to ultimately run and sell the company, john, so I know you are so teaching as a professor and marketing entrepreneurship, your methodology with teaching is to explore with your students what a successful entrepreneur was thinking, when he first started his company, and how he identified opportunities and connected adults. Could you run us through this process with how you first started Truman’s? What did you think about the industry back then? And what were the opportunities that you yourself saw? Yeah, so trumans is a company I started right after big ass fans. And you’re talking about the methodology of the classes that I teach. And look, I think everything is about context. I think everything is about teaching someone the why behind the decision process. And as I look at what we saw in trumans, and I look at other successful entrepreneurs who found companies, ultimately, it’s what they saw in the moment that makes the company so special and successful. So as an example, for us, we looked at home cleaning as a category. And what we observed is it was not structured well for the digital transformation. And so when we think about categories, ultimately what’s happening is it’s going from manufacturer to the end use consumer faster than ever before. But the friction within a lot of cleaning products, like take your average glass cleaner, it’s composed of 98% water. And so when you think about manufacturing a product that is 98% water and has to move through the supply chain, a lot of cost is allocated to the weight of water, which is a non essential ingredient, which actually exists at the point of venues as well as the volume, the actual size of that product. And so we looked at the category and said there must be a better way to do it. How could we solve for a supply chain, and a strategy around innovation that shrinks the product that as we look at this digital transformation, more companies, moving products faster, more companies developing one to one relationship, direct relationships with the consumer, how can we actually design a product that works in that context that moves faster, that is more efficient, and ultimately more sustainable from an end to end perspective for the consumer, you actually draw some of the experience and the thought process from biggest fans because you actually said that they were doing direct consumers. So it sounds like you already touched upon what you learned and applied it to treatments as well. Absolutely. I think every stage of our lives, we should take a step back and look at what we’ve learned from the experiences that were going through at the time. And for me, one of the most dynamic elements of big ass fans was the fact that it’s sold direct. And the power of that is not only speed, so your ability to sell to the customer faster, and repeat that process, but to ultimately understand the customer’s needs in very, very new ways. When you rely on distributors, there’s a layer of competition, there’s a layer of friction and that you’re not getting that feedback. What I saw

10:00

With big ass fans was exceptional, not only the one to one relationship, but the ability to really move fast develop products that met the needs of customers and really diverse ways and ultimately increase the value of the company to the US consumer, we saw that same opportunity and cleaning at the time, very, very few companies were selling direct, very few companies had a one to one relationship. And we’re even structured to work outside of traditional retail. And it’s so not about just reducing the costs and providing a more efficient delivery system to the customers. By doing a direct to customer model, you also cut the middleman and essentially provides you the higher profit margin, am I right? Yeah, that’s right. In the end, you’re providing a better value. And by providing a better value, your entire supply chain is more efficient. And I think that we can measure value in a lot of different ways. But ultimately, on the company side, the value is a higher margin profile. And it’s something that is extraordinarily meaningful. When you think about value creation disruption in the category these are all things that matter. So guys, think about your current distribution model? Is it possible for you to actually do a direct to consumer model by cutting out the middleman you may actually wind up making more money with a higher profit margin. So john, how did the industry react after your launch Truman’s? Did any of your competitors follow your business model of selling directly to your consumers? it so provide a concentrated solution without the water, we made a lot of noise. And and I think we made a lot of noise in the very beginning, because we did focus on the context. And we asked the fundamental question, which was, Why are most large cleaning companies shipping products that are 98% water and we beat that message over and over again, we beat it like a drum. And so what that did was it caught the attention of a lot of global companies. In fact, very early on hankel, which is a conglomerate out of Germany reached out to us wanting to partner. And ultimately their vision was to transform their own product portfolio using our technology. And so look, they wanted to learn from us, and they wanted to understand how they could be closer to the consumer. But in the end, they believe the thesis, which is clean products are broken, cleaning products need to move faster, the design, the inherent design of them needs to be improved. And they saw us as a solution to not only address some of the friction points that they were dealing with, but understand a completely new way of looking at the category. And as I said, when we took the approach of a whiteboard, when we said, Look, let’s not be held back by our legacy systems by our legacy manufacturing processes. Let’s just design this in the way that it should be designed based on today’s expectations of the consumer of partners, etc. I think you see a new business model. And so we caught the attention of a lot of individuals very early on. And Henkel was our first investor. So guys, just because an industry is being run in a certain manner, doesn’t mean that it’s the best way to do so have a think about how your industry is working. And if there are any efficiencies, such as the cleaning product industry that john has identified, where it’s being shipping 98% of water in his products, if you can find such inefficiency and can solve it, then that could be the key for your next million dollar idea. So john, with trumans, you actually made a disruption in the way that cleaning products have been delivered to the consumers. Could you share with us if you actually made any positive impacts on the environment? Yeah, I think you have to take a holistic approach. You know, for us, what it meant was using less distribution centers, less trucks on the road, less impact overall, and less carbon emissions as well. That’s right. So when you think about the entire supply chain, oftentimes what happens is you have a very large factory with a large footprint, that factory is producing products, trucks are lined outside those trucks transport goods to distribution centers that have to hold the products, they go from distribution centers to retail, and then on to the consumer. And the consumer typically goes to the store and picks up the product. And when you think about larger products, those larger products require larger manufacturing facilities, more trucks, larger distribution centers, and so on. And when you improve the supply chain and you shrink the product, ultimately, you benefit the entire supply chain, you’re you’re not only using less materials, but you’re taking trucks off the road using less distribution centers. Look, we we cannot continue to put more products into the supply chain to build more distribution centers that hold products that are idle, we need things to move faster, we need to manufacture in real time get those products as efficiently as possible from the manufacturer to the consumer. And we need to solve those issues in real time. And ultimately, that will impact in so many different ways. It’s almost impossible to calculate, because you get your inventory turns, right your building just in time, and ultimately you’re delivering a new value to the consumer in a much more sustainable way. Now let’s talk a little bit about the consumers themselves. How did you react when you actually introduced a product I think

15:00

consumers were very excited. We had a lot of interest in our content, we had a lot of interest in just the visual experience of seeing the product work. I think asking the question why our products shipped with 98%. Water is a compelling one. And I think it resonated with consumers in a very meaningful way. You know, ultimately, I think there are different reasons why startups exist, some exists to change the way the industry works, some exists that actually become a unicorn, a billion dollar company, I think we were on the side of really driving transformation industry, really pushing not only large companies to think different, but the consumer to ask better questions about where the products are manufactured, how they’re moving through the supply chain, and ultimately what the promises to them. And so I think we definitely inspire people to think in a new way. So guys, when you have a very clear value proposition that can actually resonate with your consumers, you can get them excited, and you can get them to be champions of your products, as well make a positive impact on their lives and in their environment. So john, can you share with us a little bit about your exit from trumans, which you achieved within three years, which is really quick? So it is reported that you sold the intellectual property behind Truman’s? How did you achieve this so quickly? You know, I think you have to be open to optionality. And I think you have to look at the business at any given moment in time in the way that it’s relevant to the market at that point. And when we started Truman’s, what we believed was there was an opportunity to build a brand that had a meaningful connection with the consumer. And we thought that that brand could exist in a lot of different forms, and ultimately deliver on a lot of different promises. As we evolved, what we learned was, there was a tremendous amount of interest in the core technology the way we worked. And so we have a lot of inbound interest from very large multinational companies I mentioned, one of them was our first investor. And we spent a lot of time working throughout their portfolio, talking about innovation, talking about the way that technology can improve not only their speed, but deliver on a better customer experience. And we really saw our business model shift. And what happened during our time operating company is the global pandemic. And what the global pandemic did was put tremendous pressure on companies to move products through the supply chain more efficiently. And the amount of inbound interest from businesses increased dramatically. During that time, there was much more of a focus on partnering with them to figure out innovative solutions to move products faster than our brand. And so look, when we started the company, we had a belief and the belief was that brand matter, I think when you fast forward to a COVID based world, and you see the real need. And the real innovation is around moving products faster through the supply chain. That’s where ultimately the value was. So we made the very difficult decision to allow for the technology to be part of a larger company. And I think we had this core belief that we wanted to fundamentally change the way the industry worked. At that moment. In time, when we looked forward, we felt like that partner because they were much larger, had greater capabilities, much greater resources, they would deliver on that promise better than we could alone. So you mentioned once in a separate interview about your time in Vegas fans, having taught you about the importance about being very close to your customers. And you also mentioned how that had an impact on you as well. How did you apply this to your advantage during the days that you are running human? I think it’s understanding what the customer needs and how they’re changing. And I shared that story that when we started the company, we really believed what our consumer and use customer was, is the person living in a home. And as the company evolved, what we started to see was the customers larger companies, and we needed to adapt and develop capabilities to support them, frankly, a startup could never build the infrastructure to support a large multinational company that’s in 90 different countries. But they have capabilities that they can go in the opposite direction, utilize technology and be more efficient. And so for us, I think that proximity to the customer ultimately allowed us to see who the benefit was going to be derived by best. And frankly, it was a much larger entity and allowing them to then transform their portfolio. Now, john, you shared about your previous experiences with some failed attempts of running a business before you went into business school went to work for General Electric and biggest fans. So the question is this, it seems to be a lot of negativity about having a corporate career before entering entrepreneurship. And there’s a lot of impatience in the current mindset of young entrepreneurs as well. What are your views on this? I think it’s all about timing. And I think it’s all about where you are from an emotional

20:00

Intellectual perspective. And so as I think back to that really young kid coming out of undergrad, wanting to be an entrepreneur, there were too many things I didn’t know. And I didn’t have a network and an ecosystem that could really support me. And what GE did was taught me a lot about the fundamentals of business, GE helped build my network, it not only gave me credibility, credibility with the name, GE and the classes that I took during my time at GE and the leadership initiatives that I was a part of, but it gave me real world experience. And looking back, what I can say his real world experience matters. Going through good times teaches you a lot going through bad times, teaches you a lot. And I mentioned earlier in this discussion that we should use every point as a learning case, I think for for us, we forget, it’s not about speed. It’s not about sprinting to the next idea and being first to market, it’s about doing it right. And it’s about setting up processes that actually do make an impact. And so for me, I learned a lot, I learned a lot of GE, I learned a lot of big ass fans, and I’ve been able to translate that forward. That is so important. I could have never started Truman’s. If I were that 20 to 23 year old kid, just not possible. There was no way I could have been able to navigate all the unique challenges that you deal when you’re facing not only issues with suppliers, but customers and the whole ecosystem around you. It’s a challenge. And so we need to be prepared. I think so much of success comes down to your knowledge, timing, and so much of timing relates to what you’ve done. And do you have an ecosystem of support around you.

So as a seasoned entrepreneur, what are your tips for new entrepreneurs, when you’re thinking about fundraising and growing your company, I think profitability matters. And it’s something that a lot of us Miss early on. I think the thing that makes you successful on day one, if you’re making $1 is the same thing that’s going to make you successful 10 years down the road, it’s just you’re going to be making a lot more than $1. And so profitability matters. And also, it’s not a race, I think taking our time to get it right matters. As I look at very successful entrepreneurs, many of them have never showed up in newspapers have never showed up in magazines. You don’t read about them online. But what they’ve done is they’ve built fundamentally strong companies, they’ve built businesses that are going to endure and last up cycles and down cycles and be around for a long period of time. And so I would say a lot of being an entrepreneur comes down to being very smart. understanding the context of where your company fits in what problem it’s solving. But setting it up in a way that will last over time I look at Carrie Smith, Carrie Smith founded big ass fans grew 20% year over year, very profitable company ultimately wanted a 200 year plan. That wasn’t to say that he was going to be running a company for 200 years, it was that the company was going to be set up so that it could enter up cycles and down cycles. That’s the approach we need to take. It isn’t about speed. I talked to a lot of entrepreneurs now who are trying to race through the steps they’re trying to get funding before the business model is well thought out, they’re then trying to deploy capital before their supply chain is set up. They’re just trying to move fast to move fast. And we do not need to do that we need to slow down and build fundamentally strong businesses understand the context of why we’re doing it, take our time, make it profitable, grow from there, fully agree john is not about growing fast is about growing at the right pace, the fundamental issues in the business and the money is deployed in the wrong manner. The business will not succeed as well. Now, john, let’s talk a little bit about your views on fundraising. What advice would you have for a new entrepreneur when thinking about raising funds?

Alignment around strategy is so important when you’re thinking about raising capital? Look, you want to find the right partner who shares your core values and who believes in growth. But you want to make sure that that growth is aligned to how you see the company working. There are a lot of investors there’s more capital today than ever before. And there’ll be even more capital in the future available to really smart and bright people with big ideas. Partnership matters, finding an organization that is aligned in the right way that has the experience working with other founders that is willing to look at you and say go talk to the founders that we’ve helped. And here are the ways that we’ve been accretive to their business that matters. And that’s important. If there is not alignment early on, there’s a tremendous amount of friction, and that friction ultimately will hurt the success and trajectory of the company. And so you

25:00

Want the arc to matter, you want the relationship to matter. These are, these are people who are now part of your company. And these are people who are going to be part of the success. And so you need to choose partnerships in a way that is aligned and is smart and is built to last guys, as Jonas shared, when you’re raising money for your company, make sure that investors that you pick can provide a strategic partnership for your company in the long run, the very last thing that you want is a silent investor who gives you the money but has no strategic value to your company. And the worst thing that can happen is that such an investor could actually prohibiting you from reaching your goals.

 Ultimately, I’d love to get back to operating a company. I think for me, I’d love to find a company that can make an impact in a category. I’m not sure what that category is yet, I think there are a lot of categories that can really make a meaningful impact on someone’s life, whether it’s through job creation, whether it’s through new innovation that helps with health. There are a lot of different ways that we can innovate. The one thing I know for certain is I want to be part of the growth story. And I want to be part of helping companies and ultimately the end use consumer, find new solutions and much more innovative ways. I think at the end, I’ll look back at this at this moment in time and say, I couldn’t have done what’s next had it not been for all the things I learned and the things I did here. So I’m keeping a very open mind about what’s next and where I go directionally. As I said, I want to get back into the operating environment, I want to be part of a team that’s really looking to innovate and disrupt within a category. But right now.

So john, if the listeners only remember one thing from today’s conversation, what would you like it to be that time matters, and we should take time to get it right. And that changes a lot. When I think about different ideas and different concepts. I teach a class around context, understanding the concept, the context of innovation, but if we think about that, it’s taking the time to understand it, observe it, figure out where you can make an impact, and then getting it right from day one. It’s not about speed. It’s about understanding why you’re doing it, taking time to do it, right. And then partnering with an ecosystem around you to build that support that will drive that business forward. Now, john, how can listeners get in contact

30:00

One of the best ways to connect with me is through LinkedIn. I’m very active on LinkedIn, I’m very authentic and approachable in terms of the content that I put out, and the people that I interact with, one of the things I love to do is meet new people. Because ultimately it helps me learn, it helps me learn about the challenges they face, the way they look at the world, and it expands my network. So LinkedIn is to me one of the best platforms out there to understand the way businesses work and get to know really interesting people in it. JOHN, thank you so much for joining us today and sharing your experiences. Thanks so much was awesome to chat with you guys. Thank you so much for joining john and i On today’s episode, so what are the inefficiencies in your industry that you can actually disrupt, you can actually find and solve this problem, you could be actually making a positive impact on the world as well. And as before, if you’ve received any value from the show, then I’d love to get your support. The best way you can show this is to subscribe to the show, leave a review on Apple podcasts and to share the show with somebody who find it useful as well. That’s all for me today. I’ll see you next time.

[This transcript has been automatically generated by a digital software and will therefore  contain errors and typos. Please kindly take note of this and only rely on the digital transcript for reference.]

00:00

Hey guys, welcome back to the TED to business show the best place for actionable advice for entrepreneurs. This is Ted, your friend and host speaking. Now on today’s episode, we have john Bostock, who is the co founder of trumans, a company designed to reduce waste and clutter in the consumer cleaning products industry. By asking you and addressing the question of why a consumer cleaning products being shipped with 98% water, humans was able to disrupt an industry that was bulk of supply chain inefficiencies, provide a product that resonated with environmentally conscious consumers and achieve a landmark exit sale in just three years. As the author of the book the elephant’s dilemma, john also shares about his journey breaking free from the safety net of a corporate career and pursuing innovation and entrepreneurship. So guys, if you ever received any value from the show, they don’t deserve to get your support. The best way you can do this is to subscribe to the show, leave a review on Apple podcasts, and to share the show with somebody who will find it useful as well. And now let’s dive right in. Hey, john, thank you so much for joining us today. Such a pleasure to have you here. It’s awesome to be here with you. JOHN, let’s start with a very simple icebreaker Could you share with us so we could all get to know you a bit better? Who is john Bostock, when he is not working? I consider myself to be a pretty average person. I’m a dad, I’ve got two kids, two crazy dogs. I live in New Orleans, Louisiana in the United States, and, you know, really try to live just a great life and raising my kids and giving them every opportunity that I wish I had growing up. So john, what are some of the options they have provided them so far, you know, I think it’s diversity of experience. And I look at my 10 year old, who’s a little bit older than my five year old, and he takes drum lessons and soccer lessons. And all of these things that I didn’t have access to, you know, music wasn’t available to me growing up sports were, but it’s the diversity that I’m really helping my kids connect the dots with, and even travel, we’re spending a lot of time. Obviously, it’s negatively impacted by COVID. But we’re spending a lot of time with the kids to help them see the world and see the diversity that exists within it. Awesome, john. Now let’s talk about the book that you wrote, the elephants don’t themer? What is it about? And what do you hope to achieve it? You know, I mentioned growing up obviously had an impact on me the way that I grew up the people around me, what I observed growing up is my ancestors took really big leaps. In fact, my grandparents came to this country with nothing and took on huge risk in doing so fast forward to me in the middle of my career, I really found myself tethered to this false reality. And what I was tethered to was this idea that this very large company I worked for at the time, was kind of a safety layer. Even though I had all these ideas that I wanted to go out and do something great, make an impact on the world, move my career forward in more innovative ways, I really felt stuck. And it took me 11 years at this very large company develop enough confidence to leave, do something really innovative. And then from there, I looked back and said, You know, I wish that I had done it sooner. And I wish that I could inspire other people to just think more broadly. And look, I’ve had a great career that 11 year career was at the General Electric Company, which is one of the top companies in the world, and certainly had amazing experiences during my time at the company. But as I look back, I wanted to inspire people to just push innovation forward in new ways to think about the world more as a global community, less insulated, less inclusive, and really push people to break free and reimagine their future at work. JOHN, now this wind the clock back a little bit you shared about your 11 years in general electric and I know you spent another few years with big gas fans. So tell us a little bit more about your time in this companies. And what actually led you to finally take that leap to start Truman’s? When did you realize that you had to break your own terrors and what gave you that strength. It was failed attempts. Even before I started GE I wanted to be an entrepreneur, I looked back at my ancestors and thought they took leaps. And I could do it too. I was too young and too inexperienced. And that inexperienced lead to failure. The failure led to going back to business school. And I was lucky in that I went to business school, I was very engaged. I learned a lot and I met someone very influential at GE, I went into the company and had the great opportunity to cycle through different businesses. So at the time, GE would crew recruit people from Business School, and place them in businesses and short term assignments to really understand the business and make an impact in a short period of time. So right away, I looked at GE as this really innovative and dynamic company that was willing to take risk with new people that thought in a different way that didn’t have legacy backgrounds and come into a situation and try to solve it. So I really enjoyed

05:00

That atmosphere and I cycled through GE plastics, which was once part of the business, GE water, GE appliances. And ultimately, I ended up at GE corporate and really that 11 year block was constant learning and constant growth. As I look back at my first jobs in the very beginning, they were tough. And I remember when I was very young, I was leading a product line and global product line, very dynamic, multi channel distribution, very complex, but I learned a lot. Fast forward to later in my GE career, we’re investing in startups, looking at ways to really innovate within the company to disrupt ourselves. And it taught me that ultimately, if you’re going to move business forward, you need to be fast, you need to be agile, you need to look at Lean principles, and say how could we wipe or this category, not rely on all the things that hold us back and not be held back by legacy systems and legacy go to market strategies, but really take totally innovative approach that that really changed my perspective. And as I was looking at what I was going to do next, you bring up big ass fans, which is a crazy named company, but had a really innovative business model. So I had the confidence to finally leave GE and to go into big ass fans, which is very dynamic. It sells large industrial fans, also sells commercial fans and residential fans. But what’s unique about the company is it sells direct. And my experience at at GE was really through traditional distribution was traditional product management, through distribution, and then on to the US consumer. And here was a very fast growing dynamic company with a quirky name that had a really, really innovative business model. And so I took the leap, to leave GE and join big ass fans to ultimately run and sell the company, john, so I know you are so teaching as a professor and marketing entrepreneurship, your methodology with teaching is to explore with your students what a successful entrepreneur was thinking, when he first started his company, and how he identified opportunities and connected adults. Could you run us through this process with how you first started Truman’s? What did you think about the industry back then? And what were the opportunities that you yourself saw? Yeah, so trumans is a company I started right after big ass fans. And you’re talking about the methodology of the classes that I teach. And look, I think everything is about context. I think everything is about teaching someone the why behind the decision process. And as I look at what we saw in trumans, and I look at other successful entrepreneurs who found companies, ultimately, it’s what they saw in the moment that makes the company so special and successful. So as an example, for us, we looked at home cleaning as a category. And what we observed is it was not structured well for the digital transformation. And so when we think about categories, ultimately what’s happening is it’s going from manufacturer to the end use consumer faster than ever before. But the friction within a lot of cleaning products, like take your average glass cleaner, it’s composed of 98% water. And so when you think about manufacturing a product that is 98% water and has to move through the supply chain, a lot of cost is allocated to the weight of water, which is a non essential ingredient, which actually exists at the point of venues as well as the volume, the actual size of that product. And so we looked at the category and said there must be a better way to do it. How could we solve for a supply chain, and a strategy around innovation that shrinks the product that as we look at this digital transformation, more companies, moving products faster, more companies developing one to one relationship, direct relationships with the consumer, how can we actually design a product that works in that context that moves faster, that is more efficient, and ultimately more sustainable from an end to end perspective for the consumer, you actually draw some of the experience and the thought process from biggest fans because you actually said that they were doing direct consumers. So it sounds like you already touched upon what you learned and applied it to treatments as well. Absolutely. I think every stage of our lives, we should take a step back and look at what we’ve learned from the experiences that were going through at the time. And for me, one of the most dynamic elements of big ass fans was the fact that it’s sold direct. And the power of that is not only speed, so your ability to sell to the customer faster, and repeat that process, but to ultimately understand the customer’s needs in very, very new ways. When you rely on distributors, there’s a layer of competition, there’s a layer of friction and that you’re not getting that feedback. What I saw

10:00

With big ass fans was exceptional, not only the one to one relationship, but the ability to really move fast develop products that met the needs of customers and really diverse ways and ultimately increase the value of the company to the US consumer, we saw that same opportunity and cleaning at the time, very, very few companies were selling direct, very few companies had a one to one relationship. And we’re even structured to work outside of traditional retail. And it’s so not about just reducing the costs and providing a more efficient delivery system to the customers. By doing a direct to customer model, you also cut the middleman and essentially provides you the higher profit margin, am I right? Yeah, that’s right. In the end, you’re providing a better value. And by providing a better value, your entire supply chain is more efficient. And I think that we can measure value in a lot of different ways. But ultimately, on the company side, the value is a higher margin profile. And it’s something that is extraordinarily meaningful. When you think about value creation disruption in the category these are all things that matter. So guys, think about your current distribution model? Is it possible for you to actually do a direct to consumer model by cutting out the middleman you may actually wind up making more money with a higher profit margin. So john, how did the industry react after your launch Truman’s? Did any of your competitors follow your business model of selling directly to your consumers? it so provide a concentrated solution without the water, we made a lot of noise. And and I think we made a lot of noise in the very beginning, because we did focus on the context. And we asked the fundamental question, which was, Why are most large cleaning companies shipping products that are 98% water and we beat that message over and over again, we beat it like a drum. And so what that did was it caught the attention of a lot of global companies. In fact, very early on hankel, which is a conglomerate out of Germany reached out to us wanting to partner. And ultimately their vision was to transform their own product portfolio using our technology. And so look, they wanted to learn from us, and they wanted to understand how they could be closer to the consumer. But in the end, they believe the thesis, which is clean products are broken, cleaning products need to move faster, the design, the inherent design of them needs to be improved. And they saw us as a solution to not only address some of the friction points that they were dealing with, but understand a completely new way of looking at the category. And as I said, when we took the approach of a whiteboard, when we said, Look, let’s not be held back by our legacy systems by our legacy manufacturing processes. Let’s just design this in the way that it should be designed based on today’s expectations of the consumer of partners, etc. I think you see a new business model. And so we caught the attention of a lot of individuals very early on. And Henkel was our first investor. So guys, just because an industry is being run in a certain manner, doesn’t mean that it’s the best way to do so have a think about how your industry is working. And if there are any efficiencies, such as the cleaning product industry that john has identified, where it’s being shipping 98% of water in his products, if you can find such inefficiency and can solve it, then that could be the key for your next million dollar idea. So john, with trumans, you actually made a disruption in the way that cleaning products have been delivered to the consumers. Could you share with us if you actually made any positive impacts on the environment? Yeah, I think you have to take a holistic approach. You know, for us, what it meant was using less distribution centers, less trucks on the road, less impact overall, and less carbon emissions as well. That’s right. So when you think about the entire supply chain, oftentimes what happens is you have a very large factory with a large footprint, that factory is producing products, trucks are lined outside those trucks transport goods to distribution centers that have to hold the products, they go from distribution centers to retail, and then on to the consumer. And the consumer typically goes to the store and picks up the product. And when you think about larger products, those larger products require larger manufacturing facilities, more trucks, larger distribution centers, and so on. And when you improve the supply chain and you shrink the product, ultimately, you benefit the entire supply chain, you’re you’re not only using less materials, but you’re taking trucks off the road using less distribution centers. Look, we we cannot continue to put more products into the supply chain to build more distribution centers that hold products that are idle, we need things to move faster, we need to manufacture in real time get those products as efficiently as possible from the manufacturer to the consumer. And we need to solve those issues in real time. And ultimately, that will impact in so many different ways. It’s almost impossible to calculate, because you get your inventory turns, right your building just in time, and ultimately you’re delivering a new value to the consumer in a much more sustainable way. Now let’s talk a little bit about the consumers themselves. How did you react when you actually introduced a product I think

15:00

consumers were very excited. We had a lot of interest in our content, we had a lot of interest in just the visual experience of seeing the product work. I think asking the question why our products shipped with 98%. Water is a compelling one. And I think it resonated with consumers in a very meaningful way. You know, ultimately, I think there are different reasons why startups exist, some exists to change the way the industry works, some exists that actually become a unicorn, a billion dollar company, I think we were on the side of really driving transformation industry, really pushing not only large companies to think different, but the consumer to ask better questions about where the products are manufactured, how they’re moving through the supply chain, and ultimately what the promises to them. And so I think we definitely inspire people to think in a new way. So guys, when you have a very clear value proposition that can actually resonate with your consumers, you can get them excited, and you can get them to be champions of your products, as well make a positive impact on their lives and in their environment. So john, can you share with us a little bit about your exit from trumans, which you achieved within three years, which is really quick? So it is reported that you sold the intellectual property behind Truman’s? How did you achieve this so quickly? You know, I think you have to be open to optionality. And I think you have to look at the business at any given moment in time in the way that it’s relevant to the market at that point. And when we started Truman’s, what we believed was there was an opportunity to build a brand that had a meaningful connection with the consumer. And we thought that that brand could exist in a lot of different forms, and ultimately deliver on a lot of different promises. As we evolved, what we learned was, there was a tremendous amount of interest in the core technology the way we worked. And so we have a lot of inbound interest from very large multinational companies I mentioned, one of them was our first investor. And we spent a lot of time working throughout their portfolio, talking about innovation, talking about the way that technology can improve not only their speed, but deliver on a better customer experience. And we really saw our business model shift. And what happened during our time operating company is the global pandemic. And what the global pandemic did was put tremendous pressure on companies to move products through the supply chain more efficiently. And the amount of inbound interest from businesses increased dramatically. During that time, there was much more of a focus on partnering with them to figure out innovative solutions to move products faster than our brand. And so look, when we started the company, we had a belief and the belief was that brand matter, I think when you fast forward to a COVID based world, and you see the real need. And the real innovation is around moving products faster through the supply chain. That’s where ultimately the value was. So we made the very difficult decision to allow for the technology to be part of a larger company. And I think we had this core belief that we wanted to fundamentally change the way the industry worked. At that moment. In time, when we looked forward, we felt like that partner because they were much larger, had greater capabilities, much greater resources, they would deliver on that promise better than we could alone. So you mentioned once in a separate interview about your time in Vegas fans, having taught you about the importance about being very close to your customers. And you also mentioned how that had an impact on you as well. How did you apply this to your advantage during the days that you are running human? I think it’s understanding what the customer needs and how they’re changing. And I shared that story that when we started the company, we really believed what our consumer and use customer was, is the person living in a home. And as the company evolved, what we started to see was the customers larger companies, and we needed to adapt and develop capabilities to support them, frankly, a startup could never build the infrastructure to support a large multinational company that’s in 90 different countries. But they have capabilities that they can go in the opposite direction, utilize technology and be more efficient. And so for us, I think that proximity to the customer ultimately allowed us to see who the benefit was going to be derived by best. And frankly, it was a much larger entity and allowing them to then transform their portfolio. Now, john, you shared about your previous experiences with some failed attempts of running a business before you went into business school went to work for General Electric and biggest fans. So the question is this, it seems to be a lot of negativity about having a corporate career before entering entrepreneurship. And there’s a lot of impatience in the current mindset of young entrepreneurs as well. What are your views on this? I think it’s all about timing. And I think it’s all about where you are from an emotional

20:00

Intellectual perspective. And so as I think back to that really young kid coming out of undergrad, wanting to be an entrepreneur, there were too many things I didn’t know. And I didn’t have a network and an ecosystem that could really support me. And what GE did was taught me a lot about the fundamentals of business, GE helped build my network, it not only gave me credibility, credibility with the name, GE and the classes that I took during my time at GE and the leadership initiatives that I was a part of, but it gave me real world experience. And looking back, what I can say his real world experience matters. Going through good times teaches you a lot going through bad times, teaches you a lot. And I mentioned earlier in this discussion that we should use every point as a learning case, I think for for us, we forget, it’s not about speed. It’s not about sprinting to the next idea and being first to market, it’s about doing it right. And it’s about setting up processes that actually do make an impact. And so for me, I learned a lot, I learned a lot of GE, I learned a lot of big ass fans, and I’ve been able to translate that forward. That is so important. I could have never started Truman’s. If I were that 20 to 23 year old kid, just not possible. There was no way I could have been able to navigate all the unique challenges that you deal when you’re facing not only issues with suppliers, but customers and the whole ecosystem around you. It’s a challenge. And so we need to be prepared. I think so much of success comes down to your knowledge, timing, and so much of timing relates to what you’ve done. And do you have an ecosystem of support around you.

So as a seasoned entrepreneur, what are your tips for new entrepreneurs, when you’re thinking about fundraising and growing your company, I think profitability matters. And it’s something that a lot of us Miss early on. I think the thing that makes you successful on day one, if you’re making $1 is the same thing that’s going to make you successful 10 years down the road, it’s just you’re going to be making a lot more than $1. And so profitability matters. And also, it’s not a race, I think taking our time to get it right matters. As I look at very successful entrepreneurs, many of them have never showed up in newspapers have never showed up in magazines. You don’t read about them online. But what they’ve done is they’ve built fundamentally strong companies, they’ve built businesses that are going to endure and last up cycles and down cycles and be around for a long period of time. And so I would say a lot of being an entrepreneur comes down to being very smart. understanding the context of where your company fits in what problem it’s solving. But setting it up in a way that will last over time I look at Carrie Smith, Carrie Smith founded big ass fans grew 20% year over year, very profitable company ultimately wanted a 200 year plan. That wasn’t to say that he was going to be running a company for 200 years, it was that the company was going to be set up so that it could enter up cycles and down cycles. That’s the approach we need to take. It isn’t about speed. I talked to a lot of entrepreneurs now who are trying to race through the steps they’re trying to get funding before the business model is well thought out, they’re then trying to deploy capital before their supply chain is set up. They’re just trying to move fast to move fast. And we do not need to do that we need to slow down and build fundamentally strong businesses understand the context of why we’re doing it, take our time, make it profitable, grow from there, fully agree john is not about growing fast is about growing at the right pace, the fundamental issues in the business and the money is deployed in the wrong manner. The business will not succeed as well. Now, john, let’s talk a little bit about your views on fundraising. What advice would you have for a new entrepreneur when thinking about raising funds?

Alignment around strategy is so important when you’re thinking about raising capital? Look, you want to find the right partner who shares your core values and who believes in growth. But you want to make sure that that growth is aligned to how you see the company working. There are a lot of investors there’s more capital today than ever before. And there’ll be even more capital in the future available to really smart and bright people with big ideas. Partnership matters, finding an organization that is aligned in the right way that has the experience working with other founders that is willing to look at you and say go talk to the founders that we’ve helped. And here are the ways that we’ve been accretive to their business that matters. And that’s important. If there is not alignment early on, there’s a tremendous amount of friction, and that friction ultimately will hurt the success and trajectory of the company. And so you

25:00

Want the arc to matter, you want the relationship to matter. These are, these are people who are now part of your company. And these are people who are going to be part of the success. And so you need to choose partnerships in a way that is aligned and is smart and is built to last guys, as Jonas shared, when you’re raising money for your company, make sure that investors that you pick can provide a strategic partnership for your company in the long run, the very last thing that you want is a silent investor who gives you the money but has no strategic value to your company. And the worst thing that can happen is that such an investor could actually prohibiting you from reaching your goals.

 Ultimately, I’d love to get back to operating a company. I think for me, I’d love to find a company that can make an impact in a category. I’m not sure what that category is yet, I think there are a lot of categories that can really make a meaningful impact on someone’s life, whether it’s through job creation, whether it’s through new innovation that helps with health. There are a lot of different ways that we can innovate. The one thing I know for certain is I want to be part of the growth story. And I want to be part of helping companies and ultimately the end use consumer, find new solutions and much more innovative ways. I think at the end, I’ll look back at this at this moment in time and say, I couldn’t have done what’s next had it not been for all the things I learned and the things I did here. So I’m keeping a very open mind about what’s next and where I go directionally. As I said, I want to get back into the operating environment, I want to be part of a team that’s really looking to innovate and disrupt within a category. But right now.

So john, if the listeners only remember one thing from today’s conversation, what would you like it to be that time matters, and we should take time to get it right. And that changes a lot. When I think about different ideas and different concepts. I teach a class around context, understanding the concept, the context of innovation, but if we think about that, it’s taking the time to understand it, observe it, figure out where you can make an impact, and then getting it right from day one. It’s not about speed. It’s about understanding why you’re doing it, taking time to do it, right. And then partnering with an ecosystem around you to build that support that will drive that business forward. Now, john, how can listeners get in contact

30:00

One of the best ways to connect with me is through LinkedIn. I’m very active on LinkedIn, I’m very authentic and approachable in terms of the content that I put out, and the people that I interact with, one of the things I love to do is meet new people. Because ultimately it helps me learn, it helps me learn about the challenges they face, the way they look at the world, and it expands my network. So LinkedIn is to me one of the best platforms out there to understand the way businesses work and get to know really interesting people in it. JOHN, thank you so much for joining us today and sharing your experiences. Thanks so much was awesome to chat with you guys. Thank you so much for joining john and i On today’s episode, so what are the inefficiencies in your industry that you can actually disrupt, you can actually find and solve this problem, you could be actually making a positive impact on the world as well. And as before, if you’ve received any value from the show, then I’d love to get your support. The best way you can show this is to subscribe to the show, leave a review on Apple podcasts and to share the show with somebody who find it useful as well. That’s all for me today. I’ll see you next time.